White Tears, White Discomfort, and the Work Nobody Wants to Do

On this episode of Feminist Founders, Becky Mollenkamp talks with social psychologist Dr. Evelyn Carter (author of Was That Racist? How to Detect, Interrupt, and Unlearn Bias in Everyday Life) about why she waited until 2026 to publish a book she could have written during the 2020 racial reckoning, what happened when she watched a community of women authors fail a basic accountability test, and why "safe space" is the wrong goal for anyone trying to build an inclusive business or community. In This Episode, We Get Into: • Why Dr. Carter didn't write her book in 2020, and what made 2026 (mid-backlash, mid-DEI-rollback) the right moment • The whiplash of clients who slashed DEI budgets in early 2020 then begged for workshops weeks later after George Floyd's murder • A real-time story of Evelyn leaving a women authors' group after watching the group's leaders fail to enforce their own community norms • The difference between a "safe space" and a "safer space," and why claiming the former is actually a red flag • The research on self-regulation of prejudice, why guilt changes behavior and anger doesn't, and what that means for how we respond to being called out • Why white women's tears in conversations about race do real, measurable harm (and what to do with those feelings instead) • Concrete, everyday microaggression examples from networking events and speaking gigs—"you're so articulate," "are you sure you're the speaker?" • The simple practice of assuming the underrepresented person in the room holds the higher-status role • Becky's own story of accidentally lecturing the one Black woman in a coaching group about diet culture, and how she repaired it • What harm repair actually looks like in practice, and why it's the missing piece in most community guidelines Resources Mentioned: • Was That Racist? How to Detect, Interrupt, and Unlearn Bias in Everyday Life by Evelyn R. Carter, PhD (Little, Brown Spark): https://amzn.to/4aS0rqe • White Tears/Brown Scars: How White Feminism Betrays Women of Color by Ruby Hamad: https://amzn.to/4epWPNh 🎤 JOIN US IN THE FEMINIST PODCASTERS COLLECTIVE: https://feministpodcastcollective.com/